The double press dilemma

[Kanelot]

After the images from Zeloc's double tact switch mod got taken down, I've noticed quite a few questions regarding how to this mod. I've made a couple of diagrams which by themselves seem to work, but when put together seem to mess everything up.

In all 3 of the following diagrams, the (A) represents analog data line, the (G) represents ground, the (3.3V) represents the 3.3 Volt line, [10K] represents a 10K resistor, and in the second and 3rd diagram, (D press) represents the digital data line and [B547] represents a B547 transistor.

In my portable, I want to have 2 buttons. The first button (called soft press), will do this

This will register as a soft press. Simple enough.

The second button (called hard+soft press) should connect the circuit for soft press, and the circuit for hard press. This way, it simulates pressing in the GameCube trigger all the way. If I were to just have this button bridge the hard press circuit, I would have to hold down both buttons to simulate pressing the GameCube trigger all the way down.

Both of these circuits should work, right? However, if you put them together, you get this:

As you can see, pressing either button will have the same effect- current will go through both 10K resistors and into the transistor, completing the hard press circuit. How can I fix this?

Sorry for any spelling errors, doing this on mobile.


EDIT: I guess the real question is, do I even need to do this? Can I just have one button for soft press, and one button that only triggers hard press? Or will games be confused if only the hard press circuit is closed (in normal gamecube controllers, when you press all the way down, it also closes the soft press circuit)?

 

[Blargaman91]

A game won't be confused if you have the digital press activated and not the analog trigger, but it may cause problems. For example, in Super Mario Sunshine, using only the digital press will cause Mario to stand in place but not spray any water.

Perhaps you could use a small relay with one pole (a SPST/SPDT) that could break/complete the circuit between the 10k resistor and the BC547. The relay would have to be powered by 3.3v because the hard-soft switch would be both activating the relay and still delivering 3.3v to the Analog line and the BC547.

EDIT: That doesn't even work. A DPDT relay should, though.

 

[Ashen]

You are really over complicating this. All you need are two tact switches and a 10k resistor. I do this in all of my portables without anything else. Just stack a squishy tact on top of a regular one.

 

[Blargaman91]

Just stack a squishy tact on top of a regular one.

I think the point is that it was desired to have two separate switches.

 

[Ashen]

Just stack a squishy tact on top of a regular one.

I think the point is that it was desired to have two separate switches.

That IS two separate switches. Why make things harder than they need to be?

 

[Blargaman91]

I meant to have two buttons that can be pressed independently, like on the Classic Controller Pro layout. But it wasn't explicitly said what the layout is, so I may have assumed incorrectly.

 

[Kanelot]

Sorry I wasn't more clear: what I mean is 2 separate buttons that can be pressed independently, not stacked on top of each other. They will be positioned next to each other, you press the one on the left for soft press and one on the right for full press. The full press button should also close the soft press circuit, just like how if you pull the GameCube trigger all the way down it triggers both full press and soft press. If this ends up being too complicated, I might just stack tact switches- this might be too difficult.

 

[Diminuendo]

you can also get double action tact switches for cameras to do the same job as Ashens setup

 

[LOCtronicz]

just do double tact method then put a tact in parallel with the digital tact. Done

 

[Bush]

I never understood why a transistor is needed. I've gotten away with a 6.8k resistor and a tact, with another tact on the digital press pins.

 

[LOCtronicz]

Let me clarify. There are 2 methods of this mod:

1. Using the transistor and resistor you will only need a single tact switch to activate the digital AND analog signals.

2. Using only 1 resistor of any ranges between 6 and 10 kohm I believe you will he able to make the analog signal activate using a single tact switch. The digital trigger is left as it is. Meaning you need 2 tact switched to trigger both lines. Hence the dual tact method of stacking them which makes it feel like you have a soft and hard press.

Now number 3. Doing method number 2 and stacking them will give you full analog AND digital press. Then adding another tact switch to the digital line will make for a digital only press. So 3 tact switches in total.

Never do both solutions at the same time cause it might mess up your controller.

 

[Blargaman91]

So the setup of having one switch activate the trigger press and another switch activate both is not feasible?

 

[LOCtronicz]

To put it simple no. I don't think it would be that much of a problem to have 2 regular tact switches stacked. That way you remove the soft and hard press. When you press one tact it will active both at the same time.

Why the need for one tact? you don't have space for two?

 

[Kanelot]

Why the need for one tact? you don't have space for two?

I was originally going to have 2 buttons next to each other: one for soft press and one to simulate pulling the trigger all the way down. Since that is apparently impossible, I'm just going to use the double tact switch method you outlined in your guide. I have some clicky black tacts and squishy orange tacts that I'll stack to make the double press triggers. I originally wasn't going to do this because I didn't think I could fit 2 tacts on top of each other (portable I'm making is reeeeeeally crammed), but I think I can squeeze them in.

Thank you all so much for your help!

 

[zack]

I'm trying to do the first method using a transistor and resistor. I have a single push button switch that needs to activate the digital and analog signals. I did this before but now the images on the original thread are gone and I can't find them. Are those images still around?

 

[xy007]

I'm trying to do the first method using a transistor and resistor. I have a single push button switch that needs to activate the digital and analog signals. I did this before but now the images on the original thread are gone and I can't find them. Are those images still around?

Did you ever get/find a working solution?

 

[zack]

I drew up this diagram based on pictures of my last portable. It DID NOT work though; the trigger buttons were shorting out the cube and causing all sorts of craziness.
http://i.imgur.com/Xstljwk.jpg?1

 

[xy007]

I drew up this diagram based on pictures of my last portable. It DID NOT work though; the trigger buttons were shorting out the cube and causing all sorts of craziness.
http://i.imgur.com/Xstljwk.jpg?1

Edit: what controller are you using? 3rd party or Nintendo?

Well I scoured about 20+ page results and came up with these diagrams,

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Sorry I don't have the actual links to the diagrams, these are screen shots I had taken awhile back.

My set up is going to have 2 buttons per trigger, one with transistor and the other not (full and half press). Although now that I think about it I may have a voltage problem if both are pressed at the same time.... or maybe not.

 

[zack]

Thanks! Screenshots or not, that first diagram is exactly the one I was looking for.
Although, it looks to be the same as my wiring so I'm not sure why I'm having issues... My controller is official Nintendo, but last time I used a 3rd party controller. Could that somehow be why?

 

[xy007]

Thanks! Screenshots or not, that first diagram is exactly the one I was looking for.
Although, it looks to be the same as my wiring so I'm not sure why I'm having issues... My controller is official Nintendo, but last time I used a 3rd party controller. Could that somehow be why?

EDIT: never mind I think I was thinking about the difference between xbox 360 pot triggers and gc.
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Also just found this site today from some one posting I think:
http://www.bacman.co.uk/home/digital-bu ... shoulders/
(has some what of a ref picture)